hi Geoff,

thanks for the kind words.

it will be interesting to see how the MM7 spell affects my friends this weekend.

stay tuned.

mikelavigne November 01, 2012 05:08

Thanks Sam.

and yes, the dart 458's are still on the way. i think within a week i'll 'know' when they will be here.

mikelavigne November 01, 2012 05:04

hello Adam,

i truely appreciate all the nice things you have written, thank you. you do know the history of my system. happy to have provided some entertainment for you and your friends over the years. as you know, great sound does not need to be over-the-top expensive, it's more a state-of-mind and result of a good plan and good thinking. trust me; my expensive system has certainly sounded like crap from time to time. so i respect that a modest appearing system can sound great. hopefully you influenced your friends to pursue fine audio too.

i look forward to continuing to share my MM7 and 'almost here' dart 458 experiences. i'll post some better MM7 pictures soon.

again thanks for your thoughful post.

best regards,

mikelavigne November 01, 2012 05:01

thanks Gary.

mikelavigne November 01, 2012 04:46

Thanks Albert, i appreciate the kind words.

i'm really enjoying it.

mikelavigne November 01, 2012 04:45

Paulo,

even though you live far away, that does not mean you cannot visit. if you ever are in the area you would be most welcome.

the twin towers are worth a bit of effort to hear. :)

mikelavigne November 01, 2012 04:43

My oh my, they look stupendous.

Your "few fully sane local friends" may start off that way but they will probably not end up that way. The loudspeakers look insane - and they probably sound insane.

Absolutely fabulous.

I live vicariously through your adventures.

Regards,

metralla November 01, 2012 03:43

Hey Mike,

CooL!
You're going to run these with the bigger Darts...right?

Best,
Sam

c1ferrari November 01, 2012 03:39

i considered being politically correct and not allow myself to get too over the top after one night. but that would simply be blowing smoke.

i've heard a number of state of the art speakers in my time.....and quite esoteric systems. i've been to my share of shows and high end stores. i've never heard anything like this before. and as good as the main towers were, you cannot even compare the main towers to the full 2 tower system. it's a whole different paradigm.

and this is with simply sitting the main towers in place, putting the tweeters at full, setting the bass towers in place and setting all the adjustments to flat and the crossover at 40hz. so far thru yesterday afternoon, the main towers have 230 hours of breakin, the bass towers started playing at 7:00pm last night. so one would think that with careful set up by the speaker designer, and hundreds more hours, and maybe even better amplification it should get better.

adding the bass towers yields dividends thru the whole frequency range, fleshing things out and adding 'ease', nuance, and tonal complexity. and think about how linear the bass is; 4 15" powered subs per channel, each in their own 150 pound sealed box, needing only the slightest excursion even at very low frequecies. and perfectly blended into the -4- 11" woofers. the complete sense of effortlessness and seamlessness is off-putting when listening to any familiar music. really breathtaking and laugh inducing. you gotta be kidding!!!

the room and speakers seem to be perfectly matched, and speak with one voice. all the work i've put into the system seems to have come together.

the music is so much less hifi, less reproduced, less processed, and more immediate, more real, more not constrained by technical limitations. the music has such a higher emotional content; not by any tonal warmth or artifact; but by simply allowing the signal to be fully rendered.

expectation bias? honeymoon syndrome? placebo effect? nope.

i guess i've left myself little room for future rationalizations. not that i think i will need it.

i think a few fully sane local friends will likely visit in the next few days/weeks....maybe they can add their more objective perspectives.

mikelavigne October 31, 2012 22:10

Mike,

I have been following the changes in your system since the time of the Wilson/Levinson/CD12/Rockport to the Kharma/Tenor/Emmlabs, the VR-9s, and the DART 108/Evolution MM3/wave kinetics/playback designs. I have always enjoyed seeing the images of your incredible room and equipment and the inspiration it provides. Notably, I am quick to visit your system page to demonstrate to my non-audiophile friends the ne plus ultra of audio when they are shocked and amazed with my more modest system. I also very much enjoy reading your insightful and eloquent posts. I was eager to see the real-life pics of the MM7 in your room as there has been such little press and no actual photos of the them on the web aside from the computer rendering on the EA website. They look incredible and I'm sure you are enjoying their output. I look forward to reading of your experiences with them along with the eventual implementation of the 458s. Congratulations.

adamg October 31, 2012 17:53

Awesome Mike!
Congrats

grr6001 October 31, 2012 11:37

Congratulations Mike, they look better in your room than the literature images I saw last year.

It will take some effort to dial everything in but you are definitely going to be able to move the air with those.

This could well be your ultimate upgrade. I'm happy for you.

albertporter October 31, 2012 04:15

they are here!

all 4 towers

right towers

left towers

excuse my sucky phtography, i just wanted to get a few pics up.

beyond my imagination.....

mikelavigne October 31, 2012 03:10

Hi Mike,

hi David,

i hear that you are now an Evolution Acoustics MM3 owner. if so, congrats to you and welcome to the Evolution family. :)

I have a few questions in relation to your room since you have been there and done that.

You have made some serious changes within design.

#1 When you installed the QuietRock was this placed on the front and/or side walls only?

the problem i had to solve was threefold. (1) i had unequal room boundaries since one side was stuctural, and one side was not. the less 'firm' side was acting slightly like a diaphram and i was getting unequal bass response. (2) the room was overdamped, too much built-in bass trapping. (3) the huge fabric covered bass traps knocked down too much high frequency energy.

the Quietrock THX 545 was added onto the existing 'cocoon' of double layer sheetrock that was behind the 10' x 15' front corner bass traps i removed. then i added a layer of 3/4" finish grade ply over the Quietrock. this change established very strong and equal room boundaries on each side, elminated the bass traps, and replaced the fabric with the finish ply 'live' surface.

i also put the Quietrock and ply on the ceiling wells front and rear where i sealed the opennings to the ceiling bass trap.

then i added the Auralex T-Fusors to there new large reflective surfaces to control any slap echo.

#2 Side walls extending how far out, to the edge of your hardwood flooring at 10 ft or further.

the room shape is basically an oval, with no sharp corners. not exactly sure what you are asking....maybe restate the question.

#3 why did you install the 3/4 inch ply good one side offer top, sonic wise what was the benifits.

added mass and aesthetics. i was trying to really solidify that wall on either side of the speakers to give the room maximum leverage for the bass. the Quietrock did most of the work, the 3/4" ply just helped. i could have painted out the Quietrock.

#4 the half round diffuser in the middle at the front you had built but now are using RPG Skyline diffuser system placed on top.

i found that the half round was not precise enough in that critical spot. the half round did a good job overall in making things sound natural and even, but the Skylines really focused the center image. really simply a low diffusion approach verses a very agressive diffusion approach.

From what you have now learned would you have still built this round diffuser or just gone flat and then used these RPG diffusers?

i cannot say with confidence that i would; however, my feeling is that the half round has a positive effect on the overall sound by scatering refections and preventing any hot spots.

#5 Curious about the rest of your room build and what if you were to do another room.

i would build exactly the same room without the original front bass traps.....and simply solifiying that wall on the right side more in the initial build. the 'bones' of the room are perfect. and the designer did tell me that it's better to build in more bass trapping than i might need as it's easy to remove but building in more later is hard.

the room does space like no other room i have ever heard, and it has a great feel and energy.

#6 you are now using Auralex T-Fusor diffusers on the sides and other areas just on top of the quietrock ans 3/4" ply correct?

correct.

#7 have you placed anything inside? is so what and sonic wise what did you find the differences to be. 6 each on the front side walls, and 4 each front ceiling and rear ceiling.

correct on the count.

no; my T-Fusors are empty. if you add any stuffing then the T-Fusors will be absorbtive and it will dampen energy and change tonality.

Room designers all appear to have their own thoughts including the actual construction method build and most I have heard for 2 channel just sounded to dead, more like for home theatre.

the whole philosophy of my room is about retainig energy everywhere. use diffusion, and minimal absorbtion. it's easy to throw absorbtion at a room to control things. it takes much more thinking and effort to control reflections to retain energy.

simply observe a concert hall. diffusion everywhere. a wood floor stage. no absorbtion.

that is the model to aspire to.

Those new speakers are looking Amazing! :)

thanks. the bass towers arrive this afternoon!!!

mikelavigne October 30, 2012 14:05

Hi Mike,
incredible speakers.
My best congratulations. If the city of Mantova (where I live) was not so far away I would ask you for a listen session.
If you desire to look for Vicoustic panel, I just published my system.
Waiting to see (unfortunately without hear) your system when bass towers will arrive.
Ciao

caliaripaolo October 30, 2012 13:15

Hi Mike,

I have a few questions in relation to your room since you have been there and done that.

You have made some serious changes within design.

#1 When you installed the QuietRock was this placed on the front and/or side walls only?

#2 Side walls extending how far out, to the edge of your hardwood flooring at 10 ft or further.

#3 why did you install the 3/4 inch ply good one side offer top, sonic wise what was the benifits.

#4 the half round diffuser in the middle at the front you had built but now are using RPG Skyline diffuser system placed on top.

From what you have now learned would you have still built this round diffuser or just gone flat and then used these RPG diffusers?

#5 Curious about the rest of your room build and what if you were to do another room.

#6 you are now using Auralex T-Fusor diffusers on the sides and other areas just on top of the quietrock ans 3/4" ply correct?

#7 have you placed anything inside? is so what and sonic wise what did you find the differences to be. 6 each on the front side walls, and 4 each front ceiling and rear ceiling.


Room designers all appear to have their own thoughts including the actual construction method build and most I have heard for 2 channel just sounded to dead, more like for home theatre.

Those new speakers are looking Amazing! :)

dev October 30, 2012 02:55

Lawrence,

yes; i do look forward to the truths revealed by recording 'live' in my room. it will be an education i'm sure.

thanks.

mikelavigne October 27, 2012 05:08

Ron,

the dart 108 is really such a great amp that set the bar so high that Herve had to really pull out all the stops without limits to surpass it. the 458 is more an amp that showed what was possible.

having had both amps in my room at the same time 2 years ago for a month, there is no doubt that the 458's do things which are unique, even fantastic. but; the 108 does prove just what an outstanding amp it is when used on a speaker which is a reasonable load. so the need for an amp 'in between' is not as significant from the perspective of the performance as it might be from a marketing point of view.

as i sit here listening to the 108 on the main towers of the MM7's it is really amazing. hard to imagine a better sounding amp.

having the MM7's all set up with the 108 for a few weeks will clearly demonstrate the relative upgrade for sure when the 458's land.

mikelavigne October 27, 2012 05:05

for those interested, this is a picture of the crossover in each MM7 main tower.....and is where the magic happens.

it took Kevin most of three weeks to build 2 of these for my set of MM7's, and this was the third pair built.

it is first order......and sits nested in the middle section with the tweeter and mid-range drivers.

depending how you look at it; the MM7's are a 3-way plus integral powered subs, or a 4-way. the woofers run free at the bottom and the subwoofers crossover to blend.

mikelavigne October 27, 2012 03:18

Mike - Wow, those Dart monos are something else! Dart definitely has a devout following and I am surprised that they don't have an amp that falls somewhere in-between those behemoths and the model NHB-108. There must be owners that can't make that level of leap but would consider spending more than what a 108 would cost them...

Good on ya, I am sure that they will bring your system to new heights and its nice that you'll have the full MM7s in place prior to their arrival so inserting them after the NHB-108 will offer a wonderful presentation of what they can do.

Ron

rgd October 27, 2012 00:17

and Bill, i'll bet in the next few days you'll be wishing you were already in Austin enjoying the sunshine and mild weather.

mikelavigne October 26, 2012 23:37

Bill,

the MM7 main towers are much more 'svelt' compared to the MM3's. and since they are 8 inches taller they appear to be 'thin'...although in truth they are massive and dense. so i agree that they look a bit 'lonely' by themselves. the 'brutish' Bass Towers will be even taller and wider and agree that it should look more in balance with them added to the look.

i'm a bit of a neat-nik as i manage a car dealership with 150 employees and fighting clutter is one of my main duties, it's a constant stuggle to maintain a proper environment for customers to be comfortable. so when i get home i need things in their place to be in my comfort zone and relax. so my room reflects my sense of orderlyness. combine that with having to sell everything i could possibly live without to afford my recent excesses and you can see the result.

best wishes at staying safe, dry and warm through the storm. i hope your power stays on so you can listen.

mikelavigne October 26, 2012 23:36

hi Jason,

i have finally recovered from my lifting last week. at least these bass tower sections are lighter (140/150 pounds each compared to 190-200 pounds each for the main tower sections) and smaller since there are 4 instead of 3.

i'll have plenty of help....and post some pics.

mikelavigne October 26, 2012 23:21

Mike, the pictures are very good. Two reactions: first, the existing speakers towers look almost lonely without the accompanying bass towers, not matter how absurd that seems, given the size of the speakers already in place. Second, I like how uncluttered your room looks. Lot's of over the top systems (and you gotta admit, you are in that league) are so filled with gear that, while it makes the gearheads happy, the aesthetic of the room is swamped by 'stuff.' That is not the case with your room- I think part of it, as we mature, is to pick out the stuff that works, and make it simpler, rather than more complicated. I look forward to seeing pics of the bass towers in place. Enjoy. We are battening down for another storm of the century. We've had 6 or 7 in the 9 years I've lived in this house.

whart October 26, 2012 20:40

Hi Lawrence, I agree live music is the reference point and live music feed to air over the radio can give wonderful results when recorded on RTR. The best music quality I hear on New Zealand radio stations is when they have musicians in the studio playing live to air.
Mike not long now I bet you are getting excited, be careful with your back lifting those big sub bins. I know what moving heavy loudspeakers is like, I am looking forward to seeing the pictures.

jasonparmenter October 26, 2012 18:53